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Kirbopher15 User is Disabled
Joined: 16 Mar 2005 Posts: 1545 Location: TOME
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:11 am Post subject: No offense but... |
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...has anyone noticed that the animation of the Rockman series is...really, lazy? I know the basics of animation because I make flash movies, but after watching so many episodes of AXESS and Stream, I gotta say that things are getting pretty crappy. I mean the story is great, and the characters look very cool and detailed...but whenever there's some sort of action scene it's always:
-some type of reused footage such as the Cross Fusion sequences or Megaman activating a weapon...followed by:
-Megaman flying across the screen in a frozen pose, with the NAVI he's fighting in a "aaack I'm hurt!" pose next to him. Or if he's fighting viruses he just does some simple motion with his weapon, and then all of the viruses, in some frozen pose, die into the cube pattern thing...rinse and repeat...
Even when other stuff is happening, it's usually just nothing but camera pans and zooms across pictures of stuff, or if they're going slightly more in depth with the fight scenes...which are rare, they have some cool actiony sequence...then a couple minutes later they just play it again...
So I hope that no one takes the as a bash or anything, like I said the show itself is a nice epic, but they need to be less lazy with the animation. Unless it's something important like the first AXESS episode, or CF Megaman vs CF Laserman, or Fore vs Slur or even ANY of the episodes of EXE... |
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DrkXFuZion Soul Unison
Joined: 16 Mar 2005 Posts: 895 Location: I'm Lost!!!
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:23 am Post subject: |
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...
Welcome to the world of anime....or actually...cartooning in general.
Rockman is by far not the only anime that does this...I can name many other animes that cut and paste scenes, changing very little besides the background and the enemy being struck...
It's called convienience. Sure, the artists get paid to do this, but this doesn't mean they are obligated to draw in every little detail perfectly just to satisfy the wants of some group of forum-goers. _________________ ~DrkX (Resident over-sexed camera-whore & Facebook zombie.)
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http://www.theundersquare.com
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SuperDanny Net Savior
Joined: 27 Mar 2005 Posts: 142 Location: In my room... pretending to do Cross Fusion.
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:32 am Post subject: |
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Hmm, I do notice the scenes that are used a lot, like Rockman using the Rockbuster, and of course the chip formation animations. Almost every chip slot in animation is recycled. I don't really mind this though, I mean, it still looks cool... About the overall quality though, I still think the actions scenes are pretty intense. I mean, there are those cheesy, "one battle chip, this picture, that picture, recycle virus deleted animation" battles... but there are still plenty of intense battles. Like, recently in episode 23 of Stream. I thought that virus battle was incredible. Lots of fresh animation and a cool use of the Fuujin Racket and Air Hockey :stonecube: _________________
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TheWebbuilder I support Rhythm x Blues!
Joined: 16 Mar 2005 Posts: 1124 Location: I don't know... But I hear laughing.
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 11:00 am Post subject: |
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That's because Anime is not animation; its a moving comic strip.
WHAT?
Actually yeah, I've noticed that. But this is made in Japan, and if that's the style they like, then that's what we get. _________________
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Kirbopher15 User is Disabled
Joined: 16 Mar 2005 Posts: 1545 Location: TOME
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 11:07 am Post subject: |
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DrkXFuZion wrote: | ...
Welcome to the world of anime....or actually...cartooning in general.
Rockman is by far not the only anime that does this...I can name many other animes that cut and paste scenes, changing very little besides the background and the enemy being struck...
It's called convienience. Sure, the artists get paid to do this, but this doesn't mean they are obligated to draw in every little detail perfectly just to satisfy the wants of some group of forum-goers. |
Oh I've known that all along, it's just that THIS specific series does it a lot more than usual. Although I remember someone saying something like how AXESS and Stream got a new animation director or something, and thus is why the EXE episodes didn't do that as often. However, the movie, like usual anime movies, looks VERY smooth and awesome compared to what you usually see in the show. That's one plus about american cartoons, they seem to be much better at animating movements when they make shows from time to time that are VERY good, like Teen Titans, Justice League, Static Shock, Avatar and the Clone Wars to name a few...although recently the US likes to make shows that looks like very well made flash movies (Xiaolin Showdown, Puffy Ami Yumi, Aqua Teens)... |
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Raijin Soul Unison
Joined: 16 Mar 2005 Posts: 842 Location: Sask. Canada
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 11:24 am Post subject: |
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There's some anime that doesn't cut corners as much as EXE does. I find that a connection with Capcom is what tends to fuel laziess like this. Believe it or not the Power Stone anime had even more instances of lazy still-shot panning and recycled footage than EXE. Now I haven't seen the Street Fighter animes but I have seen the American Street Fighter movie, and although not animated, it had its fair share of half-assedness. My theory is any form of media based on a Capcom franchise is produced as half-heartedly as the games. It must be a part of the licensing contract. Capcom refuses to let anybody make their characters look any better than they do. |
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blazequest Net Police
Joined: 15 Mar 2005 Posts: 463 Location: Quebec, Canada
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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My personal opinion is that the anime industry got so popular over the years, they have to cut corners just to meet the demands. Anime is one of the factors that pulled Japan out of it's economic hole after the second world war. Actually, I don't know how true that is... But anime do tend to use alot of tricks to get the job done quicker. Like:
-Only animating key characters parts, like animating the mouth when talking while the rest of the head remains still.
-Re-using stcok footage.
-Using freeze frames for impact or shock scenes.
-Using action lines instead of highly detailed backgrounds (Wait that might just be manga... Well I'm sure it's in anime too.)
Well, yes, I find American shows to tend to have better animation than japanese ones, even if the japanese art style is more to my liking. But I agree with the webbuilder: Anime is made from comic strips, so they try to remain loyal to the comic form. But I personally think that they cut corners because its the only way they can keep up with the work they have. _________________ Original name: blazequest |
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Glyde
Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 13 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 12:31 pm Post subject: |
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I don't really mind the action shortcuts and the reused stances so much; if only they wouldn't play out the entirity of the Cross Fusion every single time it happens! I haven't watched very many of the Axess episodes; do they continue to show the whole thing each time throughout the series? |
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SuperDanny Net Savior
Joined: 27 Mar 2005 Posts: 142 Location: In my room... pretending to do Cross Fusion.
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 12:44 pm Post subject: |
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Glyde wrote: | I don't really mind the action shortcuts and the reused stances so much; if only they wouldn't play out the entirity of the Cross Fusion every single time it happens! I haven't watched very many of the Axess episodes; do they continue to show the whole thing each time throughout the series? |
Actually no, later episodes of Axess tend to skip it, or make it much faster... _________________
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Glyde
Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 13 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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SuperDanny wrote: |
Actually no, later episodes of Axess tend to skip it, or make it much faster... |
That's good. It seems that half of each episode was taken up in the same sequence, over and over... |
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Kirbopher15 User is Disabled
Joined: 16 Mar 2005 Posts: 1545 Location: TOME
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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Well those I don't really mind, I like the music for those transformations (both langauges) |
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Tachyon360 Le Croissant
Joined: 16 Mar 2005 Posts: 740
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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Onegai Sensei had really good animation. Everyone was natural: blinking, moving, looking around, talking. Even the backgrounds were dynamic to some extent.
That's my biggest beef with Rockman.EXE. All the talking scenes are just a single frame with mouth-moving and an occasional blink added when it's that character's line.
Besides that, the animation is good enough, IMO, even the parts with those generic cube-deletion sequences. |
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anime21 Net Official
Joined: 16 Mar 2005 Posts: 351 Location: somewhere out there.
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 2:14 pm Post subject: |
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Well, many anime do the same thing, with the repeating of scenes. Many magical girl series do that. It's nothing new. But since you mention it, they have been getting a bit more into reusing old scenes. they haven't reused too much but they have been doing it. _________________
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Viewtiful Starman Puzzle Game Addict
Age: 37 Joined: 14 Mar 2005 Posts: 708
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah... as much as I'm loving Stream so far, I do have to admit that it has some of the worst animation I've seen in anime.
The art's fine, but the only anime I can remember seeing recently that used more animation tricks like that is Saiyuki (nothing can beat those animators in laziness XD).
Although, even though there is anime that does stuff like that, it's not actually quite as common as people think. There's plenty of anime that have decent/very good animation or don't have much action, so can focus their animation on other details. |
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Kirbopher15 User is Disabled
Joined: 16 Mar 2005 Posts: 1545 Location: TOME
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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Speaking of which, I finally saw the Metalman episode all the way through today. It seemed to be the opposite of what I usually think. The story and whole basis of the episode SUCKED. However, there were far more actually drawn out animations of character attacks and damage. |
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blazequest Net Police
Joined: 15 Mar 2005 Posts: 463 Location: Quebec, Canada
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 8:19 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah but when Tamako pokes Bubbleman in disbelief, the whole sequence looks horribly animated. It looked like she just magically apparated from one point to the next. _________________ Original name: blazequest |
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Hikari Ridiculously Intolerable
Joined: 15 Mar 2005 Posts: 715 Location: Too busy to stay often.
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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I've noticed too much of it in Axess and Stream. I don't mind the plug-in, Soul Unision, and Cross Fusion scenes, but some are just too overused. _________________
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Megaman 7 Net Police
Joined: 15 Mar 2005 Posts: 493 Location: I could be anywhere...
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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blazequest wrote: | Yeah but when Tamako pokes Bubbleman in disbelief, the whole sequence looks horribly animated. It looked like she just magically apparated from one point to the next. | It also looked kinda wierd when Megaman was riding on Metalmans saw wheels. Cause the blades were spinning, so Megaman should have been spinning too,right? _________________ *Join RMNSB!*
Avatar by me.
Jesus loves you. |
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Hikari Angel Soul Unison
Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 861 Location: Capital of Canada
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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when they reuse scenes inthe show they some times try to make a point, like way back in EXE the episode "Crimson Flash" was almost all reused parts from other episodes. o well thats my input, the virus deletion is boring cuz they don't even try to move, but the mets are getting better. _________________
"To give ourselves, and never count the cost of other's greater needs." |
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Nazne Shukei - Hakuteiken
Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Posts: 1133
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:30 pm Post subject: |
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Ever watched FMA? <_< There is like no stock footage at all in that show, except for a couple of shots of the Ishbal Rebellion-which are flashbacks. And even lesser characters have great animation. EXE had fairly good fighting scenes-take the Stoneman/Bombman battle in the N1, but Axess and Stream just...died. One battle, Rockman stood in place while an infected Navi lobbed a minibomb at him, and when it hit he just fell backwards, disregarding the explosion's force (or what should have been there :P)
-BMA |
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